Comments on: Manly Insecurities http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/ Neil Kramer is a writer in Los Angeles (well, New York now). Citizen of the Month is his blog. Make yourself at home. Mon, 01 Dec 2008 19:07:23 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.5 By: Neil http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213527 Neil Sat, 04 Aug 2007 15:41:46 +0000 http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213527 Deannie - On a positive note, I think each generation gets less neurotic about these issues as people get less stubborn about what a man or female is supposed to "act" like. I feel a little stuck between my parent's generation and today. Deannie - On a positive note, I think each generation gets less neurotic about these issues as people get less stubborn about what a man or female is supposed to “act” like. I feel a little stuck between my parent’s generation and today.

]]> By: deannie http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213514 deannie Sat, 04 Aug 2007 05:24:13 +0000 http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213514 People complained about FREE things? DECLINE IT IF YOU ARE SO OFFENDED. That would send the message far more effectively than petty sniping AFTER the event. You also wrote: <i><b>I can imagine being at this conference and wanting to argue and talk all the time, not wanting women to get the last word in. Isn’t that terrible? This is how WE are brought up.</b></i> Wouldn't it be more accurate to say that is how YOU were brought up? And would your mom concur with that or is that more your perception? I know that many men in my circle of friends were NOT brought up that way at all! In reality, we are all so very imperfect with our own weaknesses. This gets translated into our being raised with unreasonable notions about the opposite sex, impressed upon us either by society or our own parents. I have found a great deal of happiness in coming to grips with who I am, understanding my beliefs more (not the ones I was told to hold, but rather the beliefs I honestly live by) and changing attitudes I saw in myself that I don't like because they were misguided. I guess I really can't empathize with the things you write in this post being a gal and all but keep talking about it. It may be I need to have my eyes opened to something I am really blind to now. People complained about FREE things? DECLINE IT IF YOU ARE SO OFFENDED. That would send the message far more effectively than petty sniping AFTER the event.

You also wrote: I can imagine being at this conference and wanting to argue and talk all the time, not wanting women to get the last word in. Isn’t that terrible? This is how WE are brought up. Wouldn’t it be more accurate to say that is how YOU were brought up? And would your mom concur with that or is that more your perception? I know that many men in my circle of friends were NOT brought up that way at all!

In reality, we are all so very imperfect with our own weaknesses. This gets translated into our being raised with unreasonable notions about the opposite sex, impressed upon us either by society or our own parents. I have found a great deal of happiness in coming to grips with who I am, understanding my beliefs more (not the ones I was told to hold, but rather the beliefs I honestly live by) and changing attitudes I saw in myself that I don’t like because they were misguided.

I guess I really can’t empathize with the things you write in this post being a gal and all but keep talking about it. It may be I need to have my eyes opened to something I am really blind to now.

]]> By: Neil http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213454 Neil Fri, 03 Aug 2007 04:06:18 +0000 http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213454 Tamarika -- I think we need to meet again soon and have another Patriarchal model talk! Tamarika — I think we need to meet again soon and have another Patriarchal model talk!

]]> By: Shannon http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213442 Shannon Fri, 03 Aug 2007 01:59:00 +0000 http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213442 If it had been an oven mitt, rather than a potholder, I totally woulda kept it. If it had been an oven mitt, rather than a potholder, I totally woulda kept it.

]]> By: tamarika http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213437 tamarika Fri, 03 Aug 2007 00:25:22 +0000 http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213437 Danny, After an NAEYC conference with 10% male turn-out, I would think you know all about this! Excepting that at NAEYC there is no choice about this. At BlogHer there *is* a choice. This is such an important post, actually, Neil. I have amazing issues with inclusion and exclusion. I am hearing you loud and clear about all of this and would need to talk about ... in person ... otherwise my comment is going to turn into some kind of professorial lecture! It's this Patriarchal model thing all over again - women are sucked into it as much as men - to keep up. I want us all to meet in the middle, share everything we have to offer and make a stand for one another. Am I an idealist? Are you? Do any of us know what I am talking about? Danny,
After an NAEYC conference with 10% male turn-out, I would think you know all about this! Excepting that at NAEYC there is no choice about this. At BlogHer there *is* a choice. This is such an important post, actually, Neil. I have amazing issues with inclusion and exclusion. I am hearing you loud and clear about all of this and would need to talk about … in person … otherwise my comment is going to turn into some kind of professorial lecture!

It’s this Patriarchal model thing all over again - women are sucked into it as much as men - to keep up. I want us all to meet in the middle, share everything we have to offer and make a stand for one another. Am I an idealist? Are you? Do any of us know what I am talking about?

]]> By: Otir http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213395 Otir Thu, 02 Aug 2007 12:25:58 +0000 http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213395 I also apologize for the broken English. It looks like I have a terrible accent there. I also apologize for the broken English. It looks like I have a terrible accent there.

]]> By: Otir http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213394 Otir Thu, 02 Aug 2007 12:24:14 +0000 http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213394 I probably shouldn't post a comment now, since I haven't read all the contributions of others, and also since the post is already from yesterday, but I'd love to add my two cents, even if I am taking a risk to be out of the point. Your post is very interesting, as always. The question of identity is critical and central to everybody. The problem with an outsider "definition", like sponsors would like to imply with chosing a gender-oriented gift, is that it focuses on what people "do", when the whole issue is about what people "are". Yes "being" a mom is different than "being" a daughter (which you necessarily are, when being a mom is not the fate of every single woman). Being a cook is totally different, and is not gender defined, that is what women say when they get angry that the pot-holder would define them as such. I would add that this is a very tough quest that you go deep into, Neil, when you so hardly long for understand who the other is, as if this understanding would help you understand who you are yourself. My point is not worth more than two cents, and I truly apologize for stating in such a lengthy way, but it is dear to my heart. Being with others should lead us to accepting them, not necessarily trying so hard to understand them, because it takes us too far away from ourselves. The first step is to accept oneself, and acceptance will eventually lead to understanding... a little better. Maybe. I probably shouldn’t post a comment now, since I haven’t read all the contributions of others, and also since the post is already from yesterday, but I’d love to add my two cents, even if I am taking a risk to be out of the point.

Your post is very interesting, as always. The question of identity is critical and central to everybody. The problem with an outsider “definition”, like sponsors would like to imply with chosing a gender-oriented gift, is that it focuses on what people “do”, when the whole issue is about what people “are”.

Yes “being” a mom is different than “being” a daughter (which you necessarily are, when being a mom is not the fate of every single woman). Being a cook is totally different, and is not gender defined, that is what women say when they get angry that the pot-holder would define them as such.

I would add that this is a very tough quest that you go deep into, Neil, when you so hardly long for understand who the other is, as if this understanding would help you understand who you are yourself.

My point is not worth more than two cents, and I truly apologize for stating in such a lengthy way, but it is dear to my heart. Being with others should lead us to accepting them, not necessarily trying so hard to understand them, because it takes us too far away from ourselves.

The first step is to accept oneself, and acceptance will eventually lead to understanding… a little better.

Maybe.

]]> By: butterfly http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213384 butterfly Thu, 02 Aug 2007 03:23:01 +0000 http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213384 teeheehee -- boy, my past educational background really outed itself today, huh? It just so happens that my original career choice and love was...Psychology. That's what my degree is in. Way back when, I wanted to be a therapist -- but when I was done with school, I felt like I was still a little too screwed up myself to really be able to help people (!) I switched career paths long ago -- and in spite of my artistic parents steering me away from the starving-artist life, the pull was too strong -- hence, my ending up a graphic designer with a tendency to psychoanalyze people in her spare time. I'm not so much a "starving artist" as much as a "comfortable creative" -- so that's a happy compromise... I'd love the extra income, but I am afraid it would be unethical for me to charge you. I'm not licensed. "Unofficial therapist" is probably the safest legal option, LOL. As for Saturday night? I've got no plans...but my boyfriend and my Right-Coast locale might be a problem ;-) teeheehee — boy, my past educational background really outed itself today, huh? It just so happens that my original career choice and love was…Psychology. That’s what my degree is in. Way back when, I wanted to be a therapist — but when I was done with school, I felt like I was still a little too screwed up myself to really be able to help people (!) I switched career paths long ago — and in spite of my artistic parents steering me away from the starving-artist life, the pull was too strong — hence, my ending up a graphic designer with a tendency to psychoanalyze people in her spare time. I’m not so much a “starving artist” as much as a “comfortable creative” — so that’s a happy compromise…

I’d love the extra income, but I am afraid it would be unethical for me to charge you. I’m not licensed. “Unofficial therapist” is probably the safest legal option, LOL.

As for Saturday night? I’ve got no plans…but my boyfriend and my Right-Coast locale might be a problem ;-)

]]> By: Two Roads http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213382 Two Roads Wed, 01 Aug 2007 23:52:46 +0000 http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213382 I cook the turkey for Thanksgiving in my family and love doing it every year. My recipe is pretty simple but produces the juiciest turkey ever! I cook the turkey for Thanksgiving in my family and love doing it every year. My recipe is pretty simple but produces the juiciest turkey ever!

]]> By: Neil http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213380 Neil Wed, 01 Aug 2007 21:41:28 +0000 http://www.citizenofthemonth.com/2007/08/01/manly-insecurities/#comment-213380 Perhaps the real importance of BlogHer is not that the audience is mostly female -- but that the conference speakers are 100 percent women, so these speakers can then move on to talk at the other web conferences and make a name for themselves. Even when women are empowered, it is usually the head honchos who are the most empowered. <a href="http://www.kottke.org/07/02/gender-diversity-at-web-conferences" rel="nofollow">Diversity of speakers at web conferences</a> from Kottke. Perhaps the real importance of BlogHer is not that the audience is mostly female — but that the conference speakers are 100 percent women, so these speakers can then move on to talk at the other web conferences and make a name for themselves. Even when women are empowered, it is usually the head honchos who are the most empowered.

Diversity of speakers at web conferences from Kottke.

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